Blogging conversation

by Jay Cross on January 18, 2006

i love blogging.
i’ve blogged for five years now.
blogging let’s me say what i want.
it helps me think,
and learn.

Free the verse!
trouble is,
blogging is like talking into a phone
without an ear piece.

talk, talk, talk.
silence, silence, silence.
talk, talk, talk.
silence, comment, silence.

conversation is the ultimate learning technology.
it’s engaging.
yet few people have the opportunity
to read the conversation of comments.

i’d like a blogging tool that encourages conversation
and makes it more accessible.
not some obscure little button
or a dysfunctional work-around like archives by date.

rather, something that surfaces
conversations that are appealing.

integrated into the blogosphere.


For example, in early December, I blogged Learning Skills, ha, ha, ha. I wrote, in part,
This marvelously tongue-in-cheek report looks at 800 studies of learning styles and concludes that there are better uses for educational funding. “Learning style awareness is only a ‘cog in the wheel of the learning process’ and ‘it is not very likely that the self-concept of a student, once he or she has reached a certain age, will drastically develop by learning about his or her personal style’.”

Harold Jarche, Stephen Downes, Brian Alexander, Clark Quinn, Christopher Sessums, and Don Clark posted comments pro and con.

I dare say that few people ever saw this marvellous repartee. One exception is the fellow who added a comment 45 minutes ago. Were it not for email alterting me to his comment, I would have forgotten this disucssion entirely. Here are some of the comments I would have missed:

  • The emporer has no clothes! But many people will still make much money off of these schemes. I guess PT Barnum was right ;-)
  • In how many of the cases do the students select their own learning style, as opposed to testing ‘assigned’ learning styles? The process of double-blind experimentation sometimes blinds us.
  • Different people learn in different ways at different times and in different situations. One size does not fit everyone and slicing learnng styles into being either an A, B, C, or D doesn’t work either. There is a lot of interesting learning style research out there (e.g. Kolb) but for me, I use this as my design yardstick – adapt your instruction for as many different perspectives and approaches as possible and as much learner control as practical.
  • I spent 2.5 years leading a project building a system that adapted learning on the basis of independent learner characteristics (read: learning styles). I had several months to steep myself in the, er, research before I had the luxury to hire a psychometrician to complement the senior cognitive scientist also on the team. My take was that the measures were highly redundant (a view this report apparently concurs with).
  • Does it make sense to design a learning experience one way for Bob and a different way for Sally? Roger Schank does not belive so. In Designing World-Class E-learning: How IBM, GE, Harvard Business School, & Columbia University are succeeding at E-Learning, he insists that people do not have different learning styles, but they do have different >b>personalities. Schank’s dictum: figure it out yourself or get help.
  • Schank is right – it’s faddish, non-empirical nonsense, confusing personality traits with the process of learning. Trainers and teachers would be better served understanding personality and the role it plays in learning. This stuff is to learning what creationism is to evolutionary science.
  • The question still stands – why do the same people go through the same learning experience and some come out with an ability to apply and others don’t? As a teacher and a designer I’ve seen some otherwise inattentive learners come alive once I change my approach.
  • If one believes, as I do, that learning is adaptation to one’s surroundings, Roger Schank’s approach may be the most realistic. Life is not delivered according to learning styles.
  • Eight years later, the coping skills I learned in high school enabled me to serve in the U.S. Army for two years without doing a push-up or running a lap. I’m glad my high school didn’t have a special football team for the uncoordinated.

The conversation overall has this marvellous back-and-forth aspect that comes from the speakers having different perspectives.


spare me the lengthy articles
on learning style studies
with statistcal measures of reliabilty
but no claim to validity
in the real world.

i like learning from conversation.
and as i started to say,
i wish blogging made listening to it
a more natural thing to do.

{ 7 comments… read them below or add one }

Dave Ferguson January 19, 2006 at 7:25 am

I’m glad you made the analogy of the phone without the ear piece. From my side, reading blogs is like a room full of phones and only one mouthpiece. I can only respond to so much (if I want to earn my living). And, extending the blog-as-sound analogy, it seems almost impossible to remember where I saw X or read Y’s opinion.

With your blog’s shift, I find I can’t get the feed in the way that I used to. (This is more a description than a complaint.) I don’t have a reader; till now I’ve used Firefox and just clicked the little icon (I don’t even know what it’s called) to add a given blog. Now that doesn’t work…

I’m not a newcomer: my first online experience beyond email came when I began using GEnie back in 1984 (I wrote job aids for the first users of its online chat and threaded discussions).

“Constant change” risks moving from a characteristic to a value, and if I can’t keep up with that I should just sit back and dream of the halcyon days of WordStar.

More seriously: if you’d like people like me to join or at least follow the conversation (I realize this is not a given…), remember that when the virtual venue shifts, some of us are standing in the lobby looking for “today’s events” or trying to figure out where the Epiglottis Suite is.

“…I wish blogging made listening to it a more natural thing to do…”

I want to emphasize (lest my comment be misunderstood) that I believe you also listen — not something I think is true of every blogger.

Dave Ferguson January 19, 2006 at 7:29 am

Sigh…

The posts here don’t accept HTML tags, it seems, not even fake ones.

I had put, in the previous post, “curmudgeon” tags around the “constant change” remark. Since there’s (apparently) no previous, I couldn’t see that they were edited out.

Is there no formatting on here? (It’s like using a phone in a client’s conference room, with no one around, trying to figure out if an outside line requires a 9, or a 9 – 9, or entering the entire number and then pressing EXECUTE even though you can’t hear a dial tone…)

Administrator January 19, 2006 at 8:11 am

Dave, I hear you.

And you’re the first voice I’ve heard on these issues. Thank Goodness the incoming line is working.

I’ll nose around in WordPress. I would like to have not only HTML tagging but a Preview function as well.

jay

Administrator January 19, 2006 at 8:19 am

Dave, there appears to be some HTML allowed.

This should be bold, and this Italic.

And this font larger and one much smaller.

And a link? to the informL site?

Dave Ferguson January 19, 2006 at 11:08 am

Thanks for the fast reply… so apparently only my fake tags didn’t work, which is probably just as well.

I’ve thought a bit about this form of exchange, and want to make explicit that I recognize (as I think participants need to recognize) that not every thread necessarily invites or needs every reader. One of the contributors to The Whole Earth Catalog used to say (or quote), “Take what you can use, and let the rest go by.”

I’m attracted by the notion of a community of practice, even if “practice” is pretty loosely defined — that’s why I look forward to something like the ISPI conference, with more opportunities to learn and to discuss.

Dave

(P.S. — the footer currently reads “Internet Time Blog is proudly powered by with invalid XHTML and CSS.” Though maybe that’s true. The page source at the link for wordpress doesn’t have text between its ‘a href’ tag and the ‘/a’ tag.)

Seb Schmoller January 25, 2006 at 12:32 pm

Jay,
Higher up this page there is a dud link to http://http//metatime.blogspot.com/2005/12/learning-styles-ha-ha-ha.html – immediately above the shaded green box introducing the interesting feedback on your piece about the LSDA Learning Styles Critical Review. One thing that struck me from the discussion, unrelated to learning styles is how the LSDA’s document spread. I wrote about it soon after it was published over 18 months ago here (http://www.schmoller.net/mailings/20040621.shtml), and various people picked it up quite quickly at the time, including Stephen Downes (http://www.downes.ca/archive/04/06_21_news_OLDaily.htm), but then things went rather quiet till your piece sparked some further discussion. It would be interesting to ask LSDA about the time-profile of downloads of the two documents from its site, and I will do this.
Seb Schmoller

Administrator January 25, 2006 at 1:47 pm

Broken link is now okay.

Stephen’s post is what led me to the learning styles document.

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